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tramscape
12-09-2016, 12:50
Spring timetable now published on WEL website

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/spring2017.pdf

tramscape
12-17-2016, 20:33
Nice to see that there will be paddle steamer trips from Bournemouth again next year

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/SC-2017.pdf

if only it was a guaranteed available most-of-the-year-round call, it always seems to me a good place for a heritage centre. Plenty of tourists and visitors at least .... but I guess the zip wire thing will be more fun for most people

GeoffHamer
12-18-2016, 01:28
Next year's South Coast sailings are almost identical to this year's. In fact, they've changed little over the years. It's hardly a perfect programme because there's a lot of light running: in the course of a week, she sails light from Southampton to Swanage then Weymouth and from Swanage to Portsmouth then Southampton.

tramscape
12-18-2016, 01:50
It would indicate that they must still have been making money (or at least a decent contribution) on it .................... which is good to know

GeoffHamer
12-18-2016, 12:01
The WAVERLEY's South Coast and Thames sailings are generally well-filled so I suppose they don't want to take any chances by making changes.

tramscape
12-18-2016, 12:09
They may have taken their eye off the ball on occasion, but I certainly don't think the Waverley people are daft. So long as they make a contribution, then play safe, i say, with the south coast programme. It seems to fulfill to a large extent the charitable objects behind the "business" and these need to be adhered to

I shall comment when I see fit to praise / defend !

tramscape
12-18-2016, 12:46
Noted from the 2016 report by the WEL chairman to members of the group which is the majority shareholder in the ship :

"The company is continuing to strengthen the staff, both in the office and on the ship, to make sure the future is as secure and stable as possible".

I don't know if "strengthening" means "improving" or "expanding" or both - but I hope they don't add substantially to central costs, which seem to be on the rise

stanley37uk
12-18-2016, 21:57
There appears to be no Weymouth call on one of the Sundays !!

tramscape
12-19-2016, 00:59
Probably costs a fortune to tie up there and maybe the port is busy on the said day ?

Not sure how many people are that bothered about an hour ashore at Weymouth, but it still might be better than circling around Lulworth Cove for a few hours !

GeoffHamer
12-19-2016, 21:27
Probably costs a fortune to tie up there and maybe the port is busy on the said day ?

Not sure how many people are that bothered about an hour ashore at Weymouth, but it still might be better than circling around Lulworth Cove for a few hours !

I don't know why there is no Weymouth call on 10 September, but the WAVERLEY certainly won't be circling round Lulworth Cove - that would be a sight worth seeing.

tramscape
12-20-2016, 01:31
I wonder what they will be doing !

tramscape
12-23-2016, 00:26
As we can make out fairly clearly now, 2017 is going to be much the same as recent years

..... but were there some comments in the new edition of Paddle Wheels which are starting the process of softening us up for changes ?

Some will want them to stick with things as they are, maybe until it is too late . I have always taken the view that changes might be necessary, inevitable - and not to be feared. Things might get interesting

tramscape
01-10-2017, 19:22
Liverpool / Llandudno dates confirmed

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/IRISH-SEA-new2017.pdf

tramscape
01-13-2017, 18:06
Thames Timetable now available

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/THAMES2017.pdf

tramscape
01-18-2017, 22:25
Bristol Channel there now

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/BC-2017.pdf

Blink and you will miss it !

stanley37uk
01-19-2017, 17:32
If Balmoral does not sail there must be a huge pent up demand , can this be catered over 5 weather / positioning dependent days ?

tramscape
01-24-2017, 18:04
Clyde summer timetable now published

http://cdn.waverleyexcursions.co.uk/word/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/SCOTLAND.pdf

Very quick - and as promised by management. Clearly there are one or two things I will be looking out for as the season progresses, but here goes for another year and I hope it works out well for us at the PSPS

gillonf
01-24-2017, 19:33
I have looked at the new Clyde timetable but unfortunately do not have last year's

for comparison Are there any significant changes ?

tramscape
01-24-2017, 21:09
I haven't compared them, but here is last year's timetable

http://paddlesteamers.info/Waverley%20Sailing%20Brochures%202016/Brochure%202016%20Scotland.pdf

I've got the last few years' worth posted on my website as a reference archive for those interested

DOUG
01-25-2017, 00:31
Brodick is back in the timetable on Tuesdays 8-22 August, on completion of the major reconstruction of the ferry terminal.

tramscape
01-25-2017, 11:06
I wonder if Thursday calls will (ever?) be restored to Brodick

GeoffHamer
01-25-2017, 13:11
Waverley Excursions has a stand at the annual Excursions exhibition at Alexandra Palace in London on Saturday, as well as the SHIELDHALL and several other passenger vessel operators.
http://www.excursions2017.com/exhibitor-list.html

stanley37uk
01-26-2017, 11:44
No positioning voyage south from Oban June 7 ?

tramscape
01-26-2017, 12:03
Hadn't spotted that !

tramscape
01-26-2017, 12:33
Last year it changed to "buy tickets on the day only". When they had one of these positioning moves last year from Tobermory, the ship sailed early and a few people were left marooned

My guess (and that's all it is) is that they are leaving themselves flexible for the timing of the return voyage. presumably it is not expected to have been a big seller even if it had been timetabled

sealegs
01-26-2017, 17:42
My guess (and that's all it is) is that they are leaving themselves flexible for the timing of the return voyage. presumably it is not expected to have been a big seller even if it had been timetabled

It also means that if for any reason (like weather round the Mull of Kintyre) the return voyage had to be delayed or diverted they have no responsibility for booked passengers. I remember being landed at Ayr on one such trip back from Oban where the purser organised a taxi-shuttle up to the railway station for us to finish the journey at or own expense.

tramscape
01-26-2017, 17:59
Business simplification ! They are learning !

andrewiyoung
01-26-2017, 18:28
safe enough timetable. bit dull for the anniversary year. had three 'big' years in a row and not one Inverary/Stranraer/Ardrishaig. tempted by the Arrochar run I guess. Is there any reason why the ship does not carry passengers dwn the Irish coast on positiioning run south and north regulations wise. It just seems that they sail past an income stream for 30hrs staright burning money with none coming in.

tramscape
01-26-2017, 18:37
Her certificate doesn't allow her to carry passengers more than 18 miles from the coast and more than 70 miles from her last port of call, so almost all major positioning runs are ruled out

Inveraray pier, as I understand it, is no longer suitable for calls and I would expect that strict financial judgement has been used to decide whether unusual and far-flung cruises are sensible or not. I see that Redbay is hanging on in there ........

andrewiyoung
01-26-2017, 20:39
didnt know that about inver pier. tbh i maintain that an inverary (if pos) or starnraer would be viable if advertised early enough and with t and c to the effect that a minimum uptake is required by x date or else refund or substitute cruise will be offered. I cant believe heres no combo down the irish coast that would work. any passenger carried would offset some light costs.

http://www.askaboutireland.ie/_internal/gxml!0/2ocqn930ubywvi8z0wl9dhefnm6z926$esvc9h8j7ls5wperfp6p8obv4wtpbj1

surely not 71 miles between each of these piers lol. pier costs would prob scupper it though

and cheeky final non Wav thing-was looking at dresden timetable yesterday. is there such thing as a runaround/day ticket or is a return all there is. can you break journey multiple times out and back on a return.

tramscape
01-26-2017, 21:22
Looking at the Dresden website, it does seem very use unfriendly compared to how it was and there definitely doesn't seem to be a day-ticket. When I was there I definitely did hop-on hop-off and doubled back on myself on occasion. That was quite a long time ago now and there are fewer services now and that might not be so feasible

It does seem that you have to book a time-specific ticket as the website does say that they take you on to the final payment screen after "checking capacities". That would indicate that they have a rather good computer system for booking up space by service/vessel. Could be an issue though if a smaller ship has to be substituted in emergency !

If this is the case, it will take a lot of the fun out of it

It indicates that there might be situations when individual services are booked out - but in general I believe they have had a bad year last year, so plenty of services must run fairly lightly loaded. There has been talk of disposing of vessels in the press, but it won't be one of the paddlers as they are protected historical monuments

Regarding Waverley I do think it best that they just make a dash for wherever they are going and keep things simple !

DOUG
01-27-2017, 00:33
I can confirm that Inveraray pier is in a sorry state and closed to the public and closed to all vessels.
I saw it last year and it's no longer possible to walk up the pier. The pier would need substantial money spent on it if it were ever to reopen, which frankly, I can't see happening.
Even when the pier was still open to traffic, it was a very long haul up Loch Fyne and a long drag back down again. Great for enthusiasts but not so great for the ordinary general public.

stanley37uk
01-27-2017, 10:57
I am sure I went on Waverley one year all the way to the absolute head of Loch Fyne / Loch Shira and we picked up / set down at Inveraray
Anyone confirm , dates etc ?

tramscape
01-27-2017, 12:35
A brief look brings up the following dates for (timetabled) calls at Inveraray

Saturday June 22, 1996

Friday April 26, 1991

Can't immediately see any more going back to 1980. A bit of fun seeing all the places around the country she went in those days, though !

There is an undated photo of her off Inveraray in the Golden Jubilee book

I also have a photo of her at Inveraray on my website, taken on 15th September 1959

tramscape
01-27-2017, 12:52
Further to the info in post #34 above, here's agreat photo on Flickr by S Mck noted as being taken on May 19, 2007 (which was indeed correct)

https://www.flickr.com/photos/8831655@N07/542208479

and here's one from 16th June 1976

https://www.railscot.co.uk/locationnew.php?loc=Inveraray&offset=&photographer=

Alao 23rd Sept, 1972 on a PSPS Scottish branch charter

tramscape
01-27-2017, 13:04
Further to all the above, there's an undated post card of her off Inveraray for sale on e-bay for the real collectors !

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PS-Waverley-Paddle-Steamer-Inveraray-Loch-Fyne-Argyll-Bute-Postcard-/381896948208?hash=item58ead4f9f0

stanley37uk
01-27-2017, 14:51
I have one off pics at Portencross ( great place ) and Carradale .
Dates and years anyone ?

tramscape
01-27-2017, 18:11
Portencross - Easter Sunday, 1995

Carradale - 27th September 1992

There are quite a few pictures of both these calls on the internet / facebook

stanley37uk
01-27-2017, 19:32
Thanks - another one/off I recall is Ardyne Point prob 1975 or 1976 ?

tramscape
01-27-2017, 19:50
No mention of Ardyne in the calls list in the recent Deayton/Quinn history

Having said that they seem to have missed Fairlie (Railway pier) off the list !!!!

Ardyne was, of course, served for a period around that time by Queen of Scots in her capacity as a construction workers' ferry from Rothesay

stanley37uk
01-27-2017, 23:07
I have a pic at Ardyne but its in the garage with hundreds of others !!
Did she ever call at Otter Ferry in Loch Fyne , I have a recollection of a cruise heading in that direction ?
Is there a weblink to the Quinn list ?

sealegs
01-27-2017, 23:11
I cant believe heres no combo down the irish coast that would work. any passenger carried would offset some light costs.

http://www.askaboutireland.ie/_internal/gxml!0/2ocqn930ubywvi8z0wl9dhefnm6z926$esvc9h8j7ls5wperfp6p8obv4wtpbj1

surely not 71 miles between each of these piers lol. .

One problem with the Irish coast is that you are dealing with two different regimes which would require a separate regulatory approval south of Carlingford Lough, which would potentially be both time consuming and therefore costly. In the context of this discussion would add to rather than detract from positioning costs.

Arguably she could run between Derry, Belfast Lough (includes Donaghadee, Bangor and possibly Carrickfergus), Portaferry (Strangford Lough) and Warrenpoint (Carlingford Lough) but that might produce more revenue as two or three days of sailings on the Northern Irish Coast than as positioning calls. She could then head light for Liverpool / North Wales, before going on to Bristol Channel and points further South. The question though is whether the extra costs/risks of Northern Ireland sailings would bring in more revenue than she could have earned elsewhere.

As we've found with Balmoral getting the numbers outside the regular sailing areas requires resources and effort which may not always be available.

tramscape
01-27-2017, 23:28
Did she ever call at Otter Ferry in Loch Fyne , I have a recollection of a cruise heading in that direction ?
Is there a weblink to the Quinn list ?

Otter Ferry was Easter 1993 (You didn't read the current Steam Yachts Iolaire and Merlin thread then !)

The Quinn list is in the recent WSN 40 year history book so I don't think you'll find it on the web. It also just has ports/piers/quays of call (UK and elsewhere) but no dates

The book itself is a great read, highly fascinating and well worth getting - and not your usual book as most of the text is written by those who actually did the work itself.

tramscape
01-27-2017, 23:35
I have a pic at Ardyne but its in the garage with hundreds of others !!


Maybe a lot of these would be worth wider circulation / publication ?

DOUG
01-28-2017, 00:50
Thanks - another one/off I recall is Ardyne Point prob 1975 or 1976 ?

Yes, Waverley called at Ardyne on a PSPS charter which I arranged. From memory, I think it was (Sept?) 1976. Not the most scenic of calling points as it was basically a construction site but it was certainly different! Not a lot to do on disembarking at Ardyne apart from taking a photograph. I recall the pier had no timber fenders, just steel sheeting, so care had to be taken when berthing to avoid damage to the ship.

tramscape
01-28-2017, 01:50
Good old google - I should have gone back there rather than to iain !

September 79 it says - picture here (Alistair's book as sole author !)

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=aTqIAwAAQBAJ&pg=PT135&lpg=PT135&dq=waverley+ardyne+psps+charter&source=bl&ots=nJw33AgJ_T&sig=Ci3Nw8q-pZKW12XzFQ754t5jztw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjyy5f5zuPRAhUkBcAKHaQLBVMQ6AEILDAD#v=onepage&q=waverley%20ardyne%20psps%20charter&f=false

I even have the book right in front of me here on my shelves !!!

McCrorie & Monteith's Clyde Piers - A pictorial Record (1982) has a picture at Ardyne - but only of Glen Sannox, Queen of Scots and Sound of Islay ..... but interesting enough getting all those three in the same shot amongst all the construction rigs etc

France Fenwick
01-28-2017, 15:03
Not noticed the 18.06.2004 sailing to Inveraray mentioned but I may have jumped the all important post. Photo attached of that day when I think we were taken to the head of navigation on the Loch.

tramscape
01-28-2017, 16:06
Excellent one there Robert. It was certainly not spotted Thanks

It was timetabled as having an onward cruise to Dunderave Castle so this was surely the date of the cruise we had been looking for !

I guess I started my researches going back from the year 2000, not thinking that such a thing would have been timetabled so recently. How wrong I was !

Douglas was right though ....... just shy of a 14 hour day out of Greenock might have made it one strictly for the enthusiasts (even if some amongst them might have fancied starting off in Glasgow !).............. if only some of these places were a bit nearer to base

France Fenwick
01-28-2017, 16:28
The following day was when we had a rather close encounter with Sanda.

tramscape
01-28-2017, 19:20
The following day was when we had a rather close encounter with Sanda.

.... the MAIB report of which makes fascinating reading

However, it was two days later ! What did you do on the Saturday - go to Lochranza & Tighnabruaich ?

stanley37uk
01-28-2017, 22:11
Who remembers a call at Cairnryan once ( I think she had several at Stranraer )
And she did a few calls at Irvine for the Maritime Festival .

France Fenwick
01-28-2017, 22:40
Yes Gordon, it was Lochranza which was what caused the confusion as my previous images had pictures of the Loch Tarbert arriving at Lochranza. The memory had forgotten that we had two consecutive days to the Kilbrennan Sound and had overridden my captions.

tramscape
01-28-2017, 23:01
Otter Ferry was Sunday 11th April 1993 - dubbed the first steamer call there since 1914

Alistaird
01-30-2017, 09:10
We were told at the PSPS branch meeting about 10 days ago that she has a charter on that day.

Ardyne was a call on a PSPS charter in 1980

tramscape
01-30-2017, 14:14
A new TA review has appeared saying

"I have travelled on the PS Waverley many times over the years and must say I am disappointed to see the once pleasurable experience being destroyed"

I have been critical of the odd thing in the past where I can see simple improvements which have been neglected, but what makes some people so apocalyptic ?

We now get used to hysteria on social media from some quarters ..... but about a boat trip ???? Come on !

I ignore much on what I see on social media but at least TA (like this forum) should still be a source of useful comments and relatively free from the increasingly pervasive mass hysteria

stanley37uk
01-30-2017, 14:56
Wonder why they did not make the positioning the following day ?
I assume its an Oban charter ?

tramscape
02-01-2017, 11:33
A new TA review has appeared

It has been answered very quickly - full marks !

It has been about half-answered though, the issue virtually dismissed and it does not seem as if the fix is being routinely incorporated into standard procedures. Could do much better ?

tramscape
02-01-2017, 22:56
Just found this, lifted word for word from my website !

https://www.welcometoskye.com/waverly-steam-ship-returns-skye/

I don't really mind. I can't mind - after all Waverley is for everybody and the word needs to be kept current. Nice to know I am doing my bit as a source not just for enthusiast research but for the general promotion of Waverley

I hope the powers that be now have me marked down as an important supporter and not one of those critics they keep going on about !

somewhatfoolish
02-02-2017, 19:08
Rather cheeky to plagiarise like that; even if you don't want to enforce your copyright they should acknowledge your authorship.

tramscape
02-03-2017, 00:44
Indeed so. I've had to contact people in the past......

Also, on facebook people often cut and post photos unacknowledged when they really should just post a link to the page they are on

Sometimes you just wonder if it is worth it

tramscape
02-06-2017, 01:48
Well, if Waverley ever looks as if it is going the way that Balmoral seems to be, I do hope that the powers that be come to me to go through the numbers in good time to avert crisis and plan for the future

Balmoral seems to be running out of time - 10 days to go and no sign of looking for a Plan B. Are they really the Marks & Sparks of coastal cruising ?

tramscape
02-11-2017, 23:42
Waverley must have been on telly again tonight ........ there was a flood of hits on my website from 8 pm onwards

Looking at the papers, I see that the Canal Journeys were on again !

tramscape
02-13-2017, 21:30
Quote :

"New Deloitte report offers a snapshot of the UK leisure sector, which is worth £117 billion in revenue, accounts for 7.4% of GDP and has grown 5% annually since 2010"


Analysis (mine):

Waverley gets around £ 1.7 million in revenue per year. My calculator cannot even begin to display what an infinitessibly small fraction of a percentage of the available spend that is.

I make it that this represents about £ 1950 per year spent on leisure and entertainment in the UK by every man, woman and child in the UK population

Plenty of scope for growth, I think - and plenty of money around to save every conceivable ship we can think of (Balmoral included !)

It is just that not very many people could give a damn

tramscape
02-26-2017, 12:54
She must have been on the box again last night ......with a fair number of people googling her to find out about her

I hope they got all they needed (and a lot more !) from my website ............... and maybe a few more will now walk up that gangway

DOUG
02-26-2017, 13:41
Yes, it was a repeat of the BBC4 Timeshift programme, "The People's Liners". It was broadcast last night at 8pm on BBC4 and focused on the heyday of the Bristol Channel and Clyde steamers. Balmoral and Waverley both feature prominently.

tramscape
02-26-2017, 13:43
Ah yes ...... saw that first time round ! Some well known faces, if I remember !

tramscape
03-24-2017, 20:04
Nice to see Waverley mentioned in the business pages of today's (London) Times newspaper

No - not as one of the top investment tips for the new financial year, but as part of a very small pen-picture of Jim Pettigrew. The fact that about 40 out of about 125 words relate to Waverley is quite impressive. I haven't seen an upsurge of google searches about Waverley from the Square Mile though, although there must be someone there for whom it is news !

tramscape
04-17-2017, 13:05
Lest we forget about Waverley .......

Here she was yesterday

931

DOUG
04-25-2017, 09:16
The paddler is off to the Garvel for annual dry-docking at the end of this week.

tramscape
05-15-2017, 17:38
Waverley undertook post-docking sea trials today

Much delight and some pictures over on the Waverley Support Group on FB. The pulses are beginning to race for the Waverley lovers it seems. I, of course, am totally calm.

tramscape
05-16-2017, 11:39
I see that WEL are already offering deeply discounted tickets for the early season Clyde programme on the "itison" website

Some "nutters" are already aware and getting in first

tramscape
05-20-2017, 01:30
That old chestnut of Gift Aid seems to have raised its head again !

WEL seems to have come to some most unusual arrangement with HMRC whereby the first £ 17.50 of any fare is regarded as a "donation" - ie akin to visiting a property such as a stately home - and the rest of the fare is regarded as a "sailing fare". HMRC grants gift aid on the £ 17.50 only. Not sure how that figure was come to ... but so be it. I was not aware of any change in HMRC's rules so maybe this is a bespoke agreement

There are rules as to how both portions of the fare are handled in the case of cancellations of any sailing

Wierdly, there are a "limited number" of "sailing only" fares which can only be booked in advance. Although the brochure I got today doesn't really explain this, I read it to mean that you can go on Waverley for the advertised fare less £ 17.50 if you get one of these fares. Sounds good ...... until you read the catch. You can only travel in the lower bar !!!!!! Steerage ? Dungeon more like. Who on earth would want to have a day's pleasure trip confined to that awful place ? Whisky drinkers I guess - but I can think of so many nicer places for such a thing.

tramscape
05-20-2017, 12:18
Oh, and WEL still like to allocate us nicknames when they send out their promotional mailings .....

Kind of chummy, I think .....

(I have blanked out the rest of my address from the mailing label attached !)

932


PS. Regarding the lower bar, an idea might be to turn it into a kids' playroom with toys and such things. That happens on quite a few of the swiss paddlers with their "kajute" at the forward end of the ship. Great idea and a good use for something that would otherwise be empty

sealegs
05-20-2017, 21:00
CRSC have just posted an interview with Waverley's senior master

http://crsc.org.uk/interview-captain-ross-cochrane/

tramscape
05-20-2017, 22:24
The Gift Aid idea, so simple in theory and in many cases in practice, is turning into possibly one of the most complicated tax matters on the statute book !

HMRC have recently reissued their guidelines with lots more worked examples to try and find a way through the increasingly confusing jungle, but I challenge anyone to make real sense of it.

Amazingly, the thorny issue of fares on heritage railways (and steamships too by extension) does not appear to have been tackled specifically despite this being a massive area and an area of massive controversy.

So far I have not found any heritage railways operating the procedure that Waverley appears to be introducing ... but will keep an eye out

I hope that this is not some bright spark trying to find a way round the legislation which will have to be subject to a ruling by HMRC once again !

Try reading all this !

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/charities-detailed-guidance-notes/chapter-3-gift-aid

rannoch
05-22-2017, 17:35
Oh, and WEL still like to allocate us nicknames when they send out their promotional mailings .....

Kind of chummy, I think .....

(I have blanked out the rest of my address from the mailing label attached !)

932


PS. Regarding the lower bar, an idea might be to turn it into a kids' playroom with toys and such things. That happens on quite a few of the swiss paddlers with their "kajute" at the forward end of the ship. Great idea and a good use for something that would otherwise be empty

Otherwise be empty? I take it you are not on board very often. Either that or you avoid the lower bar. During the Glasgow Fair Fortnight they are standing on the tables, however experience has told me to avoid Waverley during that period.

tramscape
05-22-2017, 17:57
I see what you mean - I was actually referring to the kajute on the Swiss paddlers

I can't really comment on Waverley's lower bar as I avoid it and often when I am on it is shut anyway - and I don't go on her on weekends generally. But, true, living about as far away from her sailing areas as is possible in the UK, I don't go on her a right lot. (Much as I am a massive paddle steamer enthusiast, I don't really want to go on her that often anyway - less is more as they say !)

It says a lot if the lower bar on Waverley is actually used at all - she's supposed to be a sightseeing boat and that particular space does not afford any views. Hence, the Swiss steamers' equivalent spaces are totally redundant except for potentially entertaining the kids !

DOUG
05-22-2017, 19:34
The Waverley's lower bar has actually been open for business more regularly in recent seasons and specialises in selling a huge variety of malt whiskies which prove popular especially with tourists.
Because the bar is on the waterline, passengers are fascinated by the "laundrette" portholes unique atmosphere!
It is an area of the ship which has not changed much since 1947, a good thing in my view.
But yes, I agree, probably best avoided on Glasgow Fair Saturday!

tramscape
05-23-2017, 10:52
In view of those particular attractions, I wonder how many "sailing only" tickets will be sold - and who is going to operate the gate at the top of the stairs to keep them all in !

Apparently "Escape Rooms" are the new craze and are big business bringing in vast sums of money from the youth (and youngish adults) with leisure money to spare. A group are locked in a small dark room and have a certain amount of time to find the key to get out. Slip in the key some time before the ship ties up at Tighnabruaich ...... No doubt a few bottles of whisky would make the search more fun

tramscape
05-26-2017, 13:38
Well, the season has begun

Only issue is a 45 minute delay at Greenock to take on fresh water

tramscape
05-26-2017, 14:15
Hell no !!!!

Cruise terminating at Largs. Boiler trouble .......

My idea for having batteries to power her is really not so ridiculous

WEL have just posted "Waverley is unable to call at Dunoon today. We apologise for any inconvenience caused". Understand half-price vouchers for another cruise are being issued to those already aboard

Grist to the critics' mill I suspect, all this

tramscape
05-26-2017, 19:06
She's not far short of her berth now and has made good (service) speed all the way back from Largs - so it has not affected her apparent performance, so we wait to see what needs to be done !

tramscape
05-26-2017, 21:34
All is well now according to the captain. The Engineering Department sorted the problem

tramscape
06-02-2017, 17:09
Hell, I see that WEL already has clocked up its first 1 star rating on TA relating to the day of the boiler problem.

The regulars on board were all OK with it if you read their FB comments ....... but unfortunately WEL customer service (or lack of it) comes in for a massive hammering from someone presumably not so indulgent of "the company" as the complainant calls them

Handling complaints / refunds (if applicable) remains an issue - a cost and a cause for getting a bad reputation

For the loss of a little bit of working capital (gained at massive potential expense) maybe "the company" should not take advance bookings - but have it "first come first served". I would do it that way. It can't be worse than what happens now !!!

steamjoe
06-02-2017, 17:39
The boiler again? -->


SATURDAY JUNE 3
Waverley's sailing from Oban at 12.30 to the 4 Lochs and Whirlpool will not be running as Waverley needs to undergo a minor repair in Oban.

tramscape
06-02-2017, 19:09
The boiler again? -->


SATURDAY JUNE 3
Waverley's sailing from Oban at 12.30 to the 4 Lochs and Whirlpool will not be running as Waverley needs to undergo a minor repair in Oban.

No - a trawler wire got caught up in the paddles in Portree.

The Raasay trip was cancelled but she made her way back to Kyle - and now on to Oban

They are hoping to have things sorted for tomorrow's evening cruise

PS - more ticket/refund administration and no doubt more Mr Angries !

tramscape
06-02-2017, 23:58
Word going round is that two paddle floats and one radius rod need replacing tomorrow

Waverley sailed to Oban without passengers (possibly due to time/daylight restrictions on her passenger certificate ???)

tramscape
06-03-2017, 11:16
She got back to Oban at 5 minutes past midnight - so would not have been very nice had passengers been aboard

Marisco
06-03-2017, 12:25
I wonder how the passengers got back to Kyle of Lochalsh? There are not many coach firms up there, never mind coach firms with coaches available at short notice!

tramscape
06-03-2017, 13:19
i thought that they took passengers back to Kyle - the Oban run was a repositioning run with tickets for the single trip being sold on the day only, but none were sold

It seems like this evening's cruise is off though

Marisco
06-03-2017, 13:57
No the trip was Kyle to Raasay, Portree where the incident happened, then a round Raasay cruise, and back to Portree and Raasay before returning to Kyle. I understand the trip was abandoned in Portree where the damage was investigated. I doubt they would have come back to Kyle with passengers before the repositioning trip from Kyle to Oban but I am happy to be corrected.

i should have been on board for Thursday and Friday but a family crisis meant that I cancelled.

Glad that the damage seems to have been not too serious though I presume she sailed very slowly back from Portree to Oban with the paddle damage.

Be glad to hear from anyone who was on board as to what happened & when as my sources were not on board.

tramscape
06-03-2017, 14:29
Yes the round Raasay cruise from Portree was cancelled but Marine traffic shows her calling at Raasay and Kyle on her way to Oban, so presumably Kyle and Raasay passengers got home at least

She made 10.3 knots consistently on the voyage leaving Portree at 1-30 and getting to Oban at around midnight

There are reports on the PSW Support Group on FB from people on board

I should add that calls were - Raasay 14-30 and Kyle 16-10

DOUG
06-03-2017, 20:31
Yes, I can confirm she returned passengers to Kyle yesterday.
Hopefully repairs will be completed by this evening and normal service tomorrow.

tramscape
06-04-2017, 15:25
Waverley hasn't made it to Iona today - environmental conditions, not mechanical .....

She is staying in relatively sheltered waters hugging the mainland coast - presumably on a most unusual route which might delight the regulars if not so much the general public

She is currently heading towards Crinan

tramscape
06-06-2017, 10:05
At least Waverley is now getting some 5 star reviews (and of course it ought to !!!) but when someone posts "You need to book in advance for the longer journeys" it is a bit worrying

No way to correct such "false news" - and WEL probably won't when they get round to thanking the reviewer for taking time to do the review.

It may create a bit of uncertaintly in the minds of the general public - and definitely more work for the LQ office - still life is all about perception and not generally real facts and we all have to live with it

stanley37uk
06-06-2017, 15:05
Is there a charter today , she seems to heading into Loch Sunart ?

tramscape
06-06-2017, 15:23
Yes - a three day private charter

stanley37uk
06-06-2017, 15:35
Jeez that must be lucrative !! Any ideas of routes , destination etc .........would also explain lack of postioning sailing S as usual

DOUG
06-06-2017, 15:37
Tobermory today and probably return to Oban.
Next two days somewhat weather dependent.

tramscape
06-06-2017, 17:39
Jeez that must be lucrative !!

I could not comment on any commercial arrangements but at least it should guarantee income and eliminate risk - and what with current weather conditions is surely going to yield a better return than a public service would have

tramscape
06-06-2017, 17:58
Thirteen hours left .... and counting...... if you want some dirt cheap Waverley tickets

https://www.itison.com/Glasgow/deals/waverley-sailing-ticket

Better hurry up as the advert is circulating on supporters' forums. Yes, Waverley fans want Waverley on the cheap !

stanley37uk
06-07-2017, 11:26
Heading to Islay today - long way for a day trip ?

tramscape
06-07-2017, 11:34
One can only speculate ....... as supporters monitoring the ship's movements have been !

I understood she was still under charter (unless the charterer had a get-out clause !) and it could be Campbeltown tonight and Glasgow tomorrow night. That would be eminently sensible from a financial planning point of view !

kylemore
06-07-2017, 12:17
One can only speculate ....... as supporters monitoring the ship's movements have been !

I understood she was still under charter (unless the charterer had a get-out clause !) and it could be Campbeltown tonight and Glasgow tomorrow night. That would be eminently sensible from a financial planning point of view !

And just who is this mystery charterer with the deep pockets?

millfield153a
06-07-2017, 12:26
Jim Pettigrew, long time Waverley supporter

tramscape
06-07-2017, 12:59
Ah ! He was the likely suspect, but I see that it is confirmed in the public domain by the new CRSC report of Waverley's week up in the western isles

stanley37uk
06-07-2017, 17:41
I guess he is entertaining clients on board ? Currently berthed at Port Ellen

tramscape
06-07-2017, 19:04
When he charters it is usually for outings of accountants who are members of ICAS - but yes, as chairman of Clydesdale now, it could be such

Apparently the guests all boarded with suitcases (but I bet your bottom dollar they won't be kipping aboard) !

stanley37uk
06-07-2017, 21:04
Team bonding exercise on a rough passage back to Glasgow round the Mull ?

sealegs
06-08-2017, 00:33
Jim Pettigrew, long time Waverley supporter

Jim P was very much involved in trying to promote the use of Waverley as a Christmas Party venue on the Thames some years ago. I think the concept never took off mainly because the on-board spaces were too small for the numbers interested, who didn't want to be split up into different saloons.
He chartered another Thames pleasure boat for his party to go down river at dusk to rendezvous with the paddler returning from her day's excursion and then escort her back up to Tower Pier where a "passenger transfer" took place and the paddler then went down river again on charter to Jim P with his guests enjoying slap up hospitality provided by outside caterers.

However it is good to see he is still supportive and hopefully some of his excellent contacts will catch the bug too

tramscape
06-08-2017, 00:48
Jim P was very much involved in trying to promote the use of Waverley as a Christmas Party venue on the Thames some years ago. I think the concept never took off mainly because the on-board spaces were too small for the numbers interested, who didn't want to be split up into different saloons.
He chartered another Thames pleasure boat for his party to go down river at dusk to rendezvous with the paddler returning from her day's excursion and then escort her back up to Tower Pier where a "passenger transfer" took place and the paddler then went down river again on charter to Jim P with his guests enjoying slap up hospitality provided by outside caterers.

However it is good to see he is still supportive and hopefully some of his excellent contacts will catch the bug too

I was a guest of Jim on that one. Talking to the city sorts they seemed impressed. I take the point about the saloons - Waverley is not ideal - but the main problem as i saw it was that we buttered up the potential clients, then the ship disappeared for a year and everyone had forgotten about her ...... or chartered the ready and waiting Dixie Queen !

All was not lost though. I had rather too much champagne by the end of it, but I still got to chat to Alastair Campbell and watch him take up the bagpipes and pipe us all off at Tower Pier at the end of the evening !

stanley37uk
06-08-2017, 10:51
Appears to be static off Gigha now !!

millfield153a
06-08-2017, 10:53
Despite follow-up work, it is true that none of the 'corporates' engaged with the sort of fund-raising/charity trips that the Waverley Development Board had envisaged emerging from this (very enjoyable) jamboree (October 2010). There was, however, real interest in the ship as a static Christmas party venue on the Thames from an organisation with whom a leading Waverley supporter worked very hard and over a long period to identify a suitable berth. For a while it looked as if that might work - but it didn't!

tramscape
06-08-2017, 11:19
Good to know that there was genuine follow-through on this - thanks for that millfield. I never heard anything myself

It did seem a long shot that anything would really come from it although it was the christmas party market which the potential clients thought she would be good for - especially sailing. Seeing her sail up the Thames from the decks of the escorting motor ship was an impressive sight indeed !

Waverley needed to be there for a substantial amount of time, but although it is a long river I can certainly imagine that it would be extremely difficult to get anywhere suitable to put her ....costly too - and maybe the figures wouldn't really stack up when the bottom line was seen as there presumably was little in the way of revenue certainty

tramscape
06-08-2017, 12:19
Heading for Glasgow now ETA 1900

Will have to be quick

stanley37uk
06-08-2017, 12:50
Rather surprising no weekend Glasgow cruises but maybe maintenance is important ahead of main season ?

tramscape
06-08-2017, 14:07
It would certainly seem, on the face of it, that a Saturday in June would be a prime time to offer a public cruise

..... but who would really want to go on Waverley when there's football on ????

Marisco
06-08-2017, 15:58
It would certainly seem, on the face of it, that a Saturday in June would be a prime time to offer a public cruise

..... but who would really want to go on Waverley when there's football on ????

Me

tramscape
06-08-2017, 17:07
Me

Ha ! I can understand for sure, but I know where I would prefer to be

50,000 at Hampden, millions watching on TV .............. potentially a few hundred on Waverley

The numbers speak for themselves !

Marisco
06-10-2017, 09:18
What do you make of the "itison" offers and 100 tickets at 1947 prices?

My take is that giving away your product is never a good idea unless it generates volume sales at full price!

I cannot see this happening with these "offers" - I think it just alienates the supporters - am I alone with these thoughts?

tramscape
06-10-2017, 11:28
What do you make of the "itison" offers and 100 tickets at 1947 prices?

My take is that giving away your product is never a good idea unless it generates volume sales at full price!

I cannot see this happening with these "offers" - I think it just alienates the supporters - am I alone with these thoughts?

Colin - as I have posted regularly when these offers come up, existing supporters scramble to get the tickets. You will find that the advetrs on itison are circulated on the FB supporters forums

The 70th anniversary deal is a bit different and it is marketed directly by WEL and as a one off it seems a great thing to attract attention ...... but once again it is supporters which get wind of it first and snap up the tickets. They will regard it as a bit of a "thank you" for being a supporter - and maybe WEL intend it that way

Regarding the use of itison in general, i have doubt because it is a regular thing now - but WEL say they have done their sums and on balance it is good for the bottom line, so we can only assume they are correct

(Some will still disagree that they are managing the ship correctly ...... but that battle is now over)

tramscape
06-11-2017, 18:40
I may be getting cynical in my old age but coming across Waverley's pricing once again and reminding myself that they take a donation of £ 17.50 just for going on the ship, then add a bit more if you go for a ride, I wonder where they got the £ 17.50 figure from

They must be having a laugh. There is next to nothing to see on Waverley once you have had a look at the engines (which don't appeal to all)

I once went to Chatsworth House and Gardens and remember it being a magnificent place, so I checked up what they charge you nowadays. Only £ 19.50 !!!!

WEL would get virtually nobody aboard even if they charged just £1 to look around

They are definitely having a laugh !

kylemore
06-11-2017, 19:48
I understand where you're coming from Tramscape, however for many people this is a low wage, desperate basket case of an economy and a family day out on the Waverley at full fares is simply impossible - the Vierwaldstaettersee or Lake Geneva the Clyde is not!

We are in many ways returning to the Victorian era when working families could only afford their one day a year "doon the watter".

However it is indeed unfortunate if these low fares are exploited by people who can well afford full fare.

tramscape
06-11-2017, 20:33
Yes, it is very sad if people simply cannot afford it but I guess for most Waverley is simply low down in their spending priorities - and no disposable income left when it gets down to her turn.....

It is usually the case that the savvy buyers are the ones which nab the bargains

I don't really know who the people are who trawl through the itison and groupon offers, but if the episode in one of the Apprentice series was anything to go by, it was the young with plenty of disposable income - and I think it is regular repeat full price business which WEL has in mind too

There must be some way of targeting the genuinely needy, but this does not seem to be the way and I don't suppose that WEL alone can become masters of social engineering : their task has to be to shift a Waverley trip up the spending priority list of the existing target market

Regarding families, they certainly could do more to attract, with kids going very cheaply with an adult - and I say one, not necessarily two paying adults, because that is often the case. This extra demand seems to be needed especially in midweeks and I guess that at this time of the week, in two adult households, one might be at work - so midweek "family" tickets seems an obvious thing as they would not be displacing full farepayers.

There does seem to be some mismatch, however, when Waverley is chasing business and other sectors such as Luxury Steam Railtours are sold out months ahead - and at eye-watering prices !

We really need to get overseas tourists attracted to the Clyde resorts ..... Arab and Chinese customers are very noticeable in Switzerland these days and their spending power is high .....

kylemore
06-12-2017, 00:20
Glasgow is absolutely awash with foreign visitors just now.

Tourist related sectors in the city I know such as sightseeing tours and whisky retailing are booming.

For Waverley to take advantage of this the timetable would have to be radically reformed to offer regular repeatable visitor experiences of a suitable duration - as is common on the continent and even in the UK such as Loch Lomond, Loch Ness and on the River Dart.

However that is not going to happen, they have a formula that sort of works and is comfortable for them and they'd be too scared to try anything radical.

tramscape
06-12-2017, 00:45
Same old problem. If only Glasgow had been located at Port Glasgow ......then she would be a real goldmine

Anyway, Waverley's finances have turned around remarkably in recent years and seem robust enough to withstand at least modest increases in fuel prices

WEL are now confident enough to carry on with their formula - and aren't foolish as sometimes is made out (and no doubt they even scour the available sources for helpful ideas!)

We ought to be able to see things through for a few more years and, one would hope, be able to present the prospect of a viable operation to encourage HLF to jump in again

With a bit of luck there will be no further call on the enthusiast purse until then - but I guess HLF will extract a hefty price

Who knows, Waverley might even be a candidate for nationalisation then too

tramscape
06-12-2017, 11:07
I was in Prague for a few days a couple of weeks ago and although it is not high season yet, I have never seen so many passenger sightseeing boats all cruising around - Clapham Junction has nothing on this ! It is sad when one compares this with the offering in Glasgow (despite Glasgow having a fair tourist industry these days)

Unfortunately I did not see any of the three (yes, two oldies and one very new) steam paddlers, but I caught a glimpse of the little motor paddler "Elbis"

I didn't spend much time at the river, beautiful and very lively as it is as I was there for trams, so I was out in the suburbs (nice as they are too !) for much of the time. The old city itself is absolutely fantastic

I also went to Most and Litvinov for trams and the train ride to Most was interesting - showing just how attractive the Vltava valley near to Prague is and once you get to Usti-nad-Labem (on the Elbe river, or Labe in Czech) you are into spectacular "Bohemian Switzerland" which goes all the way downstream into "Saxon Switzerland" and to Dresden - a very beautiful run and home to the world's largest paddle steamer fleet.

Interestingly, tied up at Usti was the Elbe Princesse - one of the numerous modern river cruise boats built in the the last few years. She is remarkable in that she is one of two paddle (yes, paddle) ships built to service this fast-growing luxury holiday market. She is stern-wheeled, but amazingly, the Loire Princesse, which runs on the Loire in France (not surprisingly) is a side-wheeler !

kylemore
06-12-2017, 14:42
Same old problem. If only Glasgow had been located at Port Glasgow ......then she would be a real goldmine

Anyway, Waverley's finances have turned around remarkably in recent years and seem robust enough to withstand at least modest increases in fuel prices

WEL are now confident enough to carry on with their formula - and aren't foolish as sometimes is made out (and no doubt they even scour the available sources for helpful ideas!)

We ought to be able to see things through for a few more years and, one would hope, be able to present the prospect of a viable operation to encourage HLF to jump in again

With a bit of luck there will be no further call on the enthusiast purse until then - but I guess HLF will extract a hefty price

Who knows, Waverley might even be a candidate for nationalisation then too

Yes they do seem to be getting by from year to year a bit more comfortably, so to be honest I don't really blame them for just sticking with the same old same old!

tramscape
06-12-2017, 16:19
Further to my post no 127 above, here is the Elbe Princesse

http://www.croisieurope.co.uk/ships/ms-elbe-princesse


..... now back to Waverley - apologies for the digression ....

Marisco
06-16-2017, 08:14
Congratulations to all involved in keeping the PS Waverley sailing on this 70th Anniversary of her first voyage to Arrochar on Loch Long.

I'm sure all on this site will have read the CRSC article but still felt the milestone should be commented on in this site too!

May she sail for many years to come.

Does anyone know how the largesse of the National Lottery Heritage Fund was achieved for the last major rebuild in 2000. The work done is documented on other sites but there does not seem to be much about the approach to the Heritage Fund which was successful in achieving the significant funding. Was it through personal connections, Scottish Office / Tourism Support, or did the Treasurer / Chairman of WSN just fill in the application form?

Anyone able to elaborate? or point me to the relevant article?

Thanks,

Marisco
06-16-2017, 08:38
I am aware of the Press Release of 29/11/99 which is on the unofficial Waverley Site "Rebuild Diary" and which identifies Alan MacDonald as Chairman of WSN or Waverley Excursions?, Elie Newlands as Commercial Director - name I have not come across in my dealings with Waverley, and Ian McMillan as Project Director.

Any further info would be appreciated.

Marisco
06-16-2017, 09:09
Of course, this information might all be in my copy of "Paddler for a pound" if I could locate it!

tramscape
06-16-2017, 11:17
Colin - Probably the best reading believe it or not is in Paddle Wheels where, quarterly, for a number of years details of the application and its mechanisms were reported in great detail

I have looked at them briefly now (they are all in front of me here !) and there is a lot and I mean a lot of narrative and information

I can copy and post them to you on a pm if you like or try and distil some information is you give a few more specific questions

tramscape
06-16-2017, 11:44
Further to above post
It seems that Nick James as Chairman of PSPS was the man handling most of the paperwork for the HLF application itself

The application was on PSPS/WSN's initiative because it was clear that a major renovation was necessary to be able to continue, both in terms of the fabric of the ship and in terms of compliance with anticipated changes in regulatory requirements

It was then a matter of gathering support, with everyone aware that HLF would require partnership funding. In those deals, appeals were generally an on-going thing because of the continuing need to maintain and upgrade the ship - the appeal for more was just an extension of that

PS Ellie Newlands was a short-lived Marketing Director who was reported as making a good impression ..... but inevitably moving on as most young ambitious people will

tramscape
06-16-2017, 12:00
Back in 1996 it was forecast that the rebuild cost would br £ 4 million - with £ 3 million applied for from HLF, but surprisingly, the bulk of the balance coming from Waverley and Balmoral operating surpluses ! That put relatively little pressure on private supporters

The anticipation was that a basis annual refit's cost would come down from around £ 250 k per year to £ 75 k - the former being unsustainable

The refit costs by the time they were completed in 2003 had racked up considerably ........

Lord knows what they will be next time round - and how much supporters will be asked to contribute. Whilst WSN currently has a modicum of reserves, their survival is not completely assured and are nowhere near enough to cover anything like 25% of what a rebuild would cost ....

So, it seems that really it was a matter between WSN and HLF - just "putting in the paperwork" so to speak !

Marisco
06-16-2017, 17:41
Thanks Gordon, I knew you would know or where to look for the info.

I wonder if the devolved Scottish Govt will be able to support the next rebuild, or if the HLF would look favourably on helping a 2nd time.

tramscape
06-16-2017, 17:48
Interesting point about Scottish government support, but I would not bank on it (in any way)

To be fair to WSN, it looks like they have got through the 20 year period reasonably unscathed and a couple more years of reserve building should give the HLF confidence to support Waverley again on reasonable terms - so long as their business plan is fit for the third decade of the 21st century and regulatory requirements don't make her continued existence as unfeasible

What fuel will she need in future? Will she have to be hybrid/electric? Will she need auxiliary engines/thrusters/Schottel units ? To what extent would a hybrid ship remain "heritage" ? Would a business plan fit for the future negate the preservation of social history aspects which make Waverley a candidate for special support ?

Lots of questions to consider !

tramscape
06-16-2017, 18:05
Just looking at the videos of Waverley on her 70th anniversary cruise (including the one BBC Scotland have posted of her leaving Glasgow) it seems the weather is pretty ropey .... and talking of ropes, some issues regarding tying up at Blairmore appear to have caused a bit of damage to the pier

The numbers aboard look good to the rose-tinted eye but when everyone is up top it looks better than it actually is. Doubt it was anywhere near a sell-out

stanley37uk
06-16-2017, 20:16
Does not seem to be any cruise on Sunday , is she on charter by any chance ?

tramscape
06-16-2017, 21:27
Doubt it was anywhere near a sell-out

It definitely looked like one for the hardy old enthusiast ........ not one that caught the imagination of Glasgow's international tourists, despite it being such an important anniversary

Hey ho, it's a preservation venture after all - and if anyone else comes aboard to help pay her bills, great !

stanley37uk
06-16-2017, 22:29
I think the company would regard it as a bonus and free publicity prior to the vital main Clyde season , certainly not expecting a massive load .

tramscape
06-16-2017, 22:41
My own view is that I would hope that it would have been a massive jamboree start to the season with crowds everywhere. I could not imagine such a damp squib as it seems to have been (a piper and a few baloons, followed by a piece of cake at the bar) for such an important event to kick off a season on a high on any Swiss Lake or other European ship operating area for that matter. There would have been public beer tents, umpteen bratwurst stalls and an oom-pah-pah band, if not a local rock group or two

And .... with tickets at 1947 prices, the take-up was abysmal

Looking at the photos from the day it seems a damp squib in both senses of the word - but the enthusiasts still loved it (Jim McFadzean was aboard, so that made many's day!)

PS. Maybe the beer tents and bands are booked for tomorrow ......

tramscape
06-16-2017, 23:02
From what I can make out - about 15 at Greenock, 70 at Helensburgh and 8 at Blairmore.

Whether they all got on or were just viewing I don't know !

DOUG
06-17-2017, 01:01
I can confirm that Dr Nick James, Chairman of WSN, was the real driving force behind the 1999/2001 two stage rebuild with the late Ian McMillan, Superintendent Engineer, heading up the detailed specification and supervising the work at George Prior's yard at Great Yarmouth, sadly no longer in existence. Ian was very ably assisted by his deputy, Gordon Reid, Waverley's Chief Engineer.

DOUG
06-17-2017, 01:03
Does not seem to be any cruise on Sunday , is she on charter by any chance ?

Yes, she is on private charter.

tramscape
06-17-2017, 12:51
At least it is the start of the season, but after what could have been a big fanfare on Friday (and today) to kick off the full season, she suddenly disappears from the public !

This shows up one of the weaknesses of a one-ship operation - the failure to be able to offer a consistent public timetable, or otherwise the need to turn away potentially lucrative charters

Not saying that things should change ...... but they could !

tramscape
06-17-2017, 13:53
Not saying that things should change ...... but they could !

Over on CRSC last night we were looking at a photo of Ala (ex - Maid of Skelmorlie) tied up at Naples ....... and looking for a new home

How people would welcome one of those horrid Maids back now !

Off topic - as nobody is posting any updates on Waverley's progress today. Hope the weather is like it is with me - gorgeous - but I suspect it isn't so good. She's just entering Rothesay Bay at the minute

tramscape
06-17-2017, 14:22
Hmmn ...... new TA review from Canadian customer regarding Oban area trip entitled :

“Overcrowded and terrible customer service - DO NOT GO”

tramscape
06-17-2017, 21:59
Hell's teeth

Another one about Oban, information and refund efficiency has appeared directly on WEL's FB page including the following assessment

"An absolute bunch of amateurs running the show"......"Just remember - you are not dealing with anything like a professional organisation - they will ignore anything that they don't like to hear."

The complainant suggests just paying on the day - to avoid all the problems associated with getting refunds

I agree that this administration is the weakest point of the Waverley operation and causes much anger, more cost and badwill than is acceptable. Be done with advance payment - WSN has the financial reserves (which were quite substantial after the 2015 season at least) to fund the business without advance bookings

tramscape
06-17-2017, 22:21
Either that - or they have to invest in technology

Print you own tickets with QR codes - remove policy of allowing unused tickets from failed cruises to be transferable - intensive checking by scanner of validity of tickets aboard the ship

The only problem I can see is that WEL are very keen to ensure that everyone has a ticket - and the right ticket for the leg they are sailing on. Nothing wrong with that, but checking a ship with a few hundred on board and with various get on and get off points might mean invasive checking (and checking the loos !) and possible multiple checks throughout a cruise, That might upset customers, but the checkers could double up as customer care people and who could complain about that ? If the purser announced that frequent checks would take place, nobody could really complain. Swiss steamer companies do on board checks only (and infrequent). I do not know how many people escape detection, but the companies seem OK with the policy - and the risk

The above system would allow the office to credit unscanned tickets, which would be a nice gesture to those who didn't turn up for a booked trip - but there is always the risk of someone who hid in the loos each time the customer service agent came round claiming a refund !

tramscape
06-17-2017, 23:31
I seem to remember the policy of a few years ago was to ban people from the ship - presumably two new banning orders will be being issued on Monday morning !

DOUG
06-18-2017, 07:57
I seem to remember the policy of a few years ago was to ban people from the ship - presumably two new banning orders will be being issued on Monday morning !

No Gordon, only ONE person has been banned from the ship in the 44 year history of the Company........and with very good reason.

tramscape
06-18-2017, 10:08
Yes, sorry, Douglas, I was just sitting reading those reviews and getting ever more frustrated / annoyed, you name it, and was perfectly sober too

Comment withdrawn

I'm out the country from this afternoon for a while, so I shall have time to calm down and turn my mind to other things

stanley37uk
06-18-2017, 15:16
Charter today seems to have taken her well down the coast past Ayr

DOUG
06-18-2017, 18:49
Yes, sorry, Douglas, I was just sitting reading those reviews and getting ever more frustrated / annoyed, you name it, and was perfectly sober too

Comment withdrawn

I'm out the country from this afternoon for a while, so I shall have time to calm down and turn my mind to other things

No problem! Wherever you are going enjoy.........I bet trams are involved!

DOUG
06-18-2017, 18:52
Charter today seems to have taken her well down the coast past Ayr

Yes, Waverley was chartered today by Volvo from Largs to Ailsa Craig, I assume she got there ok! About 400 were boarding at Largs.
That's 4 days of charters she has had so far this season, a good start and it's only mid-June!

tramscape
06-18-2017, 22:41
Greetings from Vienna ..... Back again......biggest network in Europe.....will manage to photograph another chunk of it ......will try and check on poor old Johann Strauss ....

tramscape
06-18-2017, 23:07
Of course the problem with more than one scan of a QR code is that you have the risk of customers self duplicating tickets so it will not work........it is hard to see what WEL can do

andrewiyoung
06-20-2017, 16:09
So I went to Arrochar on 16th June. Walked along the high road above the loch with the aim of getting some nice shots from high but it soon dawned on me that the loch was dissapearing from view lol. rushed back to Ardgartan and was able to get some shots of Waverley coming out of the fog. so weather was pretty rubbishy yeah. boat seemed reasonbly busy all things considered. i take the view that if their are that many people on deck in foul weather then there must logically be any more sane folk sheltered below. but maybe im bing optimistic. hope not lol.

as an aside v pleasant coffee lounge at the holiday cottage office.

pics on the links if interested .

https://www.flickr.com/photos/88535173@N07/35221291872/in/dateposted/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/88535173@N07/35001190830/in/photostream/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/88535173@N07/34578965483/in/photostream/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/88535173@N07/34578467733/in/photostream/

tramscape
06-23-2017, 19:56
I am still not convinced that WEL are acting within the clearly stated guidelines in their approach to Gift Aid on "visiting" Waverley (and having a sail at the same time)

Irrespective of how the £ 17.50 was arrived at, that element of the customers' payment is treated as a donation - and Gift Aid is reclaimed from HMRC on this element only

If this is the case, WEL must clearly offer a non-Gift Aid admittance which must be at least 10% below the donation amount. Nothing I have seen gives any indication of this. It just arrogantly states that it is treated as a donation.

Therefore, non-gift aiders should be able to expect at least £ 1.75 off the payment they have to make ....... and without asking for it .... and make the decision themselves as to what to do

Quite frankly I have lost the energy to pursue this

However, if WEL/WSN have to pay back another £ 1 million to HMRC in a few years time and the ship goes under because of it ........ well. I'll be furious but not surprised

If I go on board I don't want to have the argument with Iain O'Brian like I did last time with Tony Gamblin - so I won't be Gift Aiding. keep government finances up - and taxes not as far us as they probably otherwise would be

tramscape
06-24-2017, 21:44
Campbeltown, Redbay tomorrow cancelled - windy conditions

tramscape
06-25-2017, 18:06
The PSPS charter of Waverley is coming up in the middle of next month

I'm never quite sure why this is done - it is not as if it is being chartered by a private organisation which wants the ship for commercial purposes or for an organisation which wants exclusivity

All the people on it are ones who most likely would go on her multiple times anyway. The club could easily nominate a midweek or Sunday sailing on which there would be plenty of space, for people to meet up on

The way it is happening, no more people are coming on than might otherwise come on, yet the company and by implication its supporters are paying out on fuel (and maybe wages ?) which otherwise wouldn't be consumed. Using up fuel is just money draining out of the PSPS/WSN coffers .....

OK, some money goes into PSPS branch coffers ........ but the only reason for raising money ..... is to put it into WSN coffers anyway !

tramscape
06-25-2017, 20:39
I see that it is Largs, Cumbrae and around Bute

I seem to remember that itinerary having been proposed before - and one waverleyfan3 saying that it would never catch on !

DOUG
06-25-2017, 20:48
The PSPS charter of Waverley is coming up in the middle of next month

I'm never quite sure why this is done - it is not as if it is being chartered by a private organisation which wants the ship for commercial purposes or for an organisation which wants exclusivity

All the people on it are ones who most likely would go on her multiple times anyway. The club could easily nominate a midweek or Sunday sailing on which there would be plenty of space, for people to meet up on

The way it is happening, no more people are coming on than might otherwise come on, yet the company and by implication its supporters are paying out on fuel (and maybe wages ?) which otherwise wouldn't be consumed. Using up fuel is just money draining out of the PSPS/WSN coffers .....

OK, some money goes into PSPS branch coffers ........ but the only reason for raising money ..... is to put it into WSN coffers anyway !

These mid-summer evening charters of Waverley have been hugely successful in recent years, thanks to a very hard-working PSPS Scottish Branch Committee, and one or two individuals in particular.
Allow me to explain why it is done: primarily, it is to raise money for Branch funds; it is a superb "shop window" for publicising the PSPS and to recruit new members; most of the surplus from the evening allows the Branch to make grants to Waverley. As an example, this year so far, the Branch has paid for a new spring beam for the port paddlebox, refurbished the marmoleum flooring for the "Jeanie Deans" lounge, spare paddle floats, an improved PA system and an improved ventilation system for the engine-room, all of which are very expensive items.
These evening cruises are something the company would not normally undertake themselves. Also, it is wrong to say that "no more people are coming on than might normally come on". These evening charters attract ADDITIONAL passengers, the vast majority of which are General Public, often in group bookings from the various pick-up points.
Pretty worthwhile then, in my book!

tramscape
06-25-2017, 21:30
Well, if they are extra passengers are ones who wouldn't ever go an a public cruise, that of course is a good justification, but it seems strange (to me anyway !) that it would attract people, or groups, who are not attracted to the standard programme, which is designed specifically with the general public in mind ! Also, I would have thought that such people are no more likely to join PSPS than anyone else who has seen and been on Waverley - unless there is some real pestering going on .....

If midweek evenings are popular, it may be an idea to run such cruises on a more regular basis - to replace some of the day cruises which have been known not to be exactly money-spinners on occasion

My point really was that the income from these customers could go directly to WEL without the need for say £ 1500 worth of fuel being expended - and all those things paid for by PSPS would not need to be because WEL/WSN would already have the money to do such things themselves - plus that extra £ 1500 or so for even more things !

tramscape
06-25-2017, 22:05
Further to the above, there does not appear to be Gift Aid available on fares - which I would expect not to be the case anyway as it is a members' private charter even if open to non-members (as is often the case with many clubs)

If the attracted groups had been combined with a public sailing, WSN could have claimed £ 4.38 per agreeing customer - so if, say, 400 would have gone on the special charter - further funds of (up to) £1750 could have become available to "our" coffers (us being the indivisible PSPS/WSN)

tramscape
06-25-2017, 22:54
Hard work ..... is indeed very noble and commendable, but as I have found out through so many lessons in life, it is smart work which brings the best results - and the least stress and strain

We have to continuously look for new improved ways to do things - or stay in the past and get left behind !

Now, I know Waverley is all about preserving the past, but everything associated with it has to be extra smart in order to have a chance !

tramscape
06-26-2017, 00:10
The itison deal offer is still going strong

Here is a quote from an itison member on the offer page :

"Absolutely brilliant experience, beautiful sunny day and plenty to see and do. It's the only paddle steamer in the world that still works. Can't wait to go again this year, would recommend it to everyone.”

Seems like itison generates repeat itison business rather than full-price business

Also it would appear that these offers don't include the option of Gift Aid (so that's a potential loss of another £4.38 per ticket)

I also have to swallow hard when I keep seeing the claim about Waverley's uniqueness ...... How misinformation spreads !

Marisco
06-26-2017, 08:54
I imagine it's the only one which works in his world!

Few can afford trips on Swiss / Swedish / German / Czech vessels.

tramscape
06-26-2017, 10:25
Very true - but I put most of the blame on to WEL's marketing tag line, which is very easily misinterpreted

"Sea going", for many, I guess, would include any sort of "water going" (and why not ?)............... so I don't really blame those who broadcast the information they are fed in such a way

From a wider paddle steamer point of view (and PSPS have interests outside of Waverley), it is not healthy to portray Waverley as the only survivor of its broad type - it gives the impression that they are a useless sort of ship which nobody else bothers with and begs the question of why, in the whole wide world. some Scots/Brits are running something everyone else gave up on !

Marketing them as highly popular in many parts of the world might make people more keen to sail on one - it's down to perception - "if it's popular everywhere, there must be something very good about it.......... if no-one else does it, there must be a reason why...and maybe they are not really very good at all"

kylemore
06-26-2017, 14:53
My point really was that the income from these customers could go directly to WEL without the need for say £ 1500 worth of fuel being expended - and all those things paid for by PSPS would not need to be because WEL/WSN would already have the money to do such things themselves - plus that extra £ 1500 or so for even more things !

I imagine the Bar takings alone will more than cover that!

A general point though is that there is a latent demand for evening cruises which WEL are not exploiting.

tramscape
06-26-2017, 16:31
Don't say that the evening cruise is an excuse for a p-up when those same clients would be more restrained on a public cruise !

Sunset cruises prove popular elsewhere, so why not give it a go ..... yes, I know you see the sun set on many Waverley cruises, but you know what I mean

However, how are they working out arriving back at Largs after 8 pm ? I thought that that was lockdown time.....

tramscape
07-01-2017, 14:38
Waverley had two attempts at before giving up on Dunoon today

tramscape
07-01-2017, 20:06
I thought that Captain Cochrane was reportedly doing well in the customer care stakes ...... but clearly not enough to head off this new TA review :

"Terrible !

Booked a trip to go around Raasay, something on my wife's "Bucket list". Instead we were taken to Kyle, a trip we'd done several times before, and returned by bus 3 hours late. Waverley were most un-sympathetic to the point they really couldn't care less! This was the second time on Waverley and the second time we've not gone where we booked to go, I would not recommend at all."

.....................

I see that WEL's review answerer has studiously avoided commenting on the last 1 star review. Now I know they say they like to respond to things by letter. Fair enough, but for the casual reader it looks like they are skipping things they don't like to read - and not giving any information to allay the worries of the casual viewer (who is quite possibly a prospective client). Let's see if this new one is answered, and if so, when and how ! There is of course a perfectly valid reason for the change to the programme - but why was it not communicated in the correct way ?

millfield153a
07-01-2017, 20:35
The CRSC summary of Waverley's Western Isles programme refers to 'regular updates from the bridge' on this unfortunate occasion, so who can tell why the TA complainant apparently didn't get the message?

tramscape
07-01-2017, 20:49
Yes .... there are always some people who don't hear (or listen). There should be no excuses, though, if the PA system really has been improved

The problem about customer service and market confidence is that it is all about perception. I have to ask myself why some people remain perceiving things about Waverley which are often bad and often not entirely correct ! Did that person really expect a round Raasay trip when two paddle floats were minced up and cables were wrapped around the paddle shaft ?

Anyway, WEL have a chance to state their case on TA if they so wish

millfield153a
07-01-2017, 21:52
As an aside, I think that it was principally the commentator's PA which needed to be improved. The fixed microphones (purser and bridge) seemed OK but there has been a real problem ever since the wheelhouse became unavailable as the commentator's 'studio'.

tramscape
07-01-2017, 23:53
it was principally the commentator's PA which needed to be improved.

That was certainly the biggest problem, but from my limited experience last season, other announcements were still not entirely clear to be heard, especially outside at any distance from the speaker and also if windy. I also remember difficulties hearing in a busy forward observation lounge, so a rowdy bar might have been even worse. Maybe more speakers and the volume knob turned up would have helped.

I guess the captain will not have to assume that people hear first time .... or second for that matter - often you can tell people until you are blue in the face and someone will say "What was all that ?"

stanley37uk
07-02-2017, 14:08
Ayr weather jinx strikes again today !!

tramscape
07-02-2017, 14:29
Yes, they are heading for the shelter of Arran and going round Holy Isle instead of Ailsa Craig

rannoch
07-02-2017, 21:34
I was waiting for Waverley at Ayr today when I was told that she was not coming because the weather would be too rough for going round Ailsa Craig.
Word was that she left Largs to go elsewhere.
There was a fairly strong breeze coming off the sea, but I felt confident that she would arrive. She was due to depart at 15.00. I went for a walk along the Esplanade. By 16.00 the wind had dropped to almost nothing. Believe me the waves were hardly breaking on the shore.
How can the skipper decide at Largs that the sea is going to be too rough to go round Ailsa Craig and then still proceed across the water to the Arran coast and presumably back to Largs?
I assumed that she would go round Bute certainly not to Arran.
An absolute piece of nonsense and a day out spoiled for a good number of customers, some of whom were travelling on Waverley for the first time.

tramscape
07-02-2017, 23:04
The cruise apparently returned to Largs via the Kyles

Around 150 on at Glasgow, 50 at Greenock (not bad for Greenock !!!) and probably net boardings of zero at Largs. Disappointing financially .....

It is hard to comment on whether the Captain was being too cautious or not, but with westerlies dominating they appear to have taken shelter alongside Arran

Perhaps they could have had a choppy sail around Ailsa Craig but the issue must surely have been calling at Ayr - tough at the best of times, but next to impossible otherwise. How many calls did she manage at Ayr last year - three or something ? The weather (at least that as relevant to the passengers) was reported as having improved somewhat throughout the afternoon, so maybe the improvement could not have been entirely foreseen. Published photos taken from aboard ship do show the water to be calm

With the council grant having run out, the Ayr timetabled call must surely be at real risk

stanley37uk
07-03-2017, 00:05
One call at Ayr last year - the last Monday

millfield153a
07-03-2017, 09:22
Will the Master not have sought and followed advice from the Harbourmaster at Ayr?

tramscape
07-03-2017, 10:18
One would expect so.

kylemore
07-03-2017, 21:03
Surely time to pull the plug on Ayr if only to avoid inconveniencing people and creating bad will as above.

Absolutely no criticism of the Master's decisions regarding safety of the vessel is implied.

On a positive note why not offer an inclusive coach option - perhaps in association with Dodds, from Ayr joining the boat at Largs? You could even make a small diversion via Kilmarnock bus station to offer a day out from there - that would certainly suit me!

tramscape
07-03-2017, 21:53
Well, WEL did clock a one-star review for the day on TA from a marooned Ayr person ..... whom I assume is not anyone from this board !

My views are pretty clear on this matter - but it is really a shame to abandon a calling point which is still "open" when the business is bemoaning the closure of others ...

tramscape
07-06-2017, 10:26
Will the Master not have sought and followed advice from the Harbourmaster at Ayr?

WEL write in response to two reviews on TA which refer to the missed Ailsa Craig run that they did indeed take advice from the Harbourmaster at Ayr

tramscape
07-07-2017, 11:04
Gremlins in Waverley's steering system this morning. She's stuck at her Glasgow berth and it is touch and go as to whether she will be going anywhere today .....

tramscape
07-07-2017, 11:08
Now confirmed as a no-go ......

Out of interest, I wonder if we will see any messages on the official webpage, FB page or twitter feed. Not holding out any hopes

tramscape
07-07-2017, 11:51
The website rolling newsbar has been updated - but surely for people waiting for the ship, FB or T alerts are better? Many people will have "liked" or "followed" their page and thus will get automatic alerts to new posts.

I guess the office is too busy ringing people up

tramscape
07-08-2017, 10:22
Waverley seems to be OK today - but the work boat isn't so she is canting with a rope by all accounts

I understood that this is not allowed with passengers aboard these days .....

About 20 minutes late leaving

tramscape
07-08-2017, 11:20
There were passengers aboard - so maybe it is something akin to a "flying cant" which is prohibited now

Macfarlane64
07-09-2017, 07:54
Was planning to board at Dunoon on Friday. Obviously didn't happen. I can't work out why they don't spend 30secs posting a twitter message . I found out via Maritime app she was still in Glasgow but not many people will do that.

stanley37uk
07-14-2017, 13:17
Generator fault , today cancelled . Worrying number of tech issues ?

Macfarlane64
07-15-2017, 23:28
What was the problem at Dunoon today - looks like she didn't call.

tramscape
07-16-2017, 12:01
I have not seen any reports about it to help but it is not the first time this summer she has tried ... and failed .... to moor at Dunoon

fv24
07-16-2017, 14:40
I have not seen any reports about it to help but it is not the first time this summer she has tried ... and failed .... to moor at Dunoon
Given yesterday's weather, quite possibly there were no passengers waiting at Dunoon to board, nor any wishing to go ashore. A relief master is currently in command, and he's not known for aborting a call without very good reason.

Sent from my SM-G800F using Tapatalk

tramscape
07-16-2017, 17:07
Not sure why there was no cruise from Campbeltown today - unless the breeze was a bit stiff

DOUG
07-16-2017, 17:12
Given yesterday's weather, quite possibly there were no passengers waiting at Dunoon to board, nor any wishing to go ashore. A relief master is currently in command, and he's not known for aborting a call without very good reason.

Sent from my SM-G800F using Tapatalk

The "new" breakwater berth at Dunoon is a major challenge for the Waverley. It is unsuitable as it is a solid concrete structure and has practically no fendering. Waverley has been damaged on several occasions in recent years whilst attempting to berth. To make matters worse, there are significant tidal eddies around the end of the breakwater which make things even more difficult. Representations are being made to Argyll and Bute Council who own the pier to restore at least one of the berths at the traditional steamer pier. They have already cosmetically restored the pier building and part of the walkway. It would be great if they could complete the job and restore the pier to what it was built for originally.

tramscape
07-16-2017, 17:15
The Council seem to have repaired or replaced a lot of the piles at Dunoon pier, so presumably with just a bit more attention she will be fine for the longer term use by Waverley ..... ????

tramscape
07-16-2017, 21:36
Was Waverley stuck off the Cloch for an hour on her return home tonight ? If so, why ???

tramscape
07-16-2017, 22:52
The sea state at Sanda etc was too rough. Waverley is just getting back to Glasgow now about 1 hour late. A long day

tramscape
07-16-2017, 23:11
pA very strong tide caused the delay. Already half an hour behind at Largs (and losing more time after), the captain did predict a late return and suggesting to those on board needing to get to Glasgow for connections etc that they might wish to take the train

tramscape
07-17-2017, 14:09
Late approaching Largs and crossing from Rothesay very slowly ......


...... and now waiting mid-channel off Largs ..... but for what ?

tramscape
07-17-2017, 14:31
She has been next to motionless in mid Firth for over an hour now ........

stanley37uk
07-17-2017, 14:35
Generator or paddle wheel problems or boiler problems , very worrying . The ship aint getting any younger , we sometimes forget this

tramscape
07-17-2017, 14:40
The bits that go wrong are usually the bits that are not particularly old !

stanley37uk
07-17-2017, 14:59
Back up to full speed and approaching Largs . Will be interesting to learn whats wrong .

tramscape
07-17-2017, 15:11
Now at Largs and facing north, so not going for any cruise to satisfy customers at Largs.

stanley37uk
07-17-2017, 15:15
Website says no sailing from Millport to Lochranza due to " an operating fault "

fv24
07-17-2017, 15:30
Yet again nothing on Twitter to advise of the "operational fault". Why bother having an official social media account if it's not used to update people?

Sent from my SM-G800F using Tapatalk

tramscape
07-17-2017, 15:40
Yes, people waiting at Keppel may or may not look at the website, but at least if they are on FB or Twitter they might well have liked or followed the company, so they would get alerts if there were new posts.... and be able to spread news. Incredible - and the reports were that the younger marketing people in the LQ office were social media savvy

tramscape
07-17-2017, 16:07
Apparently Waverley is going to have to be towed back to Glasgow or maybe even Greenock.

Customers at Rothesay are to come back by Cal-Mac and then bus to Greenock / Glasgow

tramscape
07-17-2017, 16:32
Buses now being marshalled at Largs pier

stanley37uk
07-17-2017, 16:36
Sounds like the boiler ? Could be a lengthy period off service
Mind you it could have happened off Mull of Kinytre or Irish SEa / N Wales

tramscape
07-17-2017, 17:22
Mind you it could have happened off Mull of Kinytre

There are some voices suggesting that the problems yesterday were not really related to the weather at the Mull or the tides up Firth after all ............. I wouldn't know myself but the conspiracy theorists tend to abound in such circumstances !

tramscape
07-17-2017, 19:01
Air pump failure, it seems

No suggestion on the WEL website that tomorrow's cruise is at risk

Macfarlane64
07-17-2017, 19:03
Is that serious? I see on website they are still advertising tomorrow's sail.

kylemore
07-17-2017, 20:19
The "new" breakwater berth at Dunoon is a major challenge for the Waverley. It is unsuitable as it is a solid concrete structure and has practically no fendering. Waverley has been damaged on several occasions in recent years whilst attempting to berth. To make matters worse, there are significant tidal eddies around the end of the breakwater which make things even more difficult. Representations are being made to Argyll and Bute Council who own the pier to restore at least one of the berths at the traditional steamer pier. They have already cosmetically restored the pier building and part of the walkway. It would be great if they could complete the job and restore the pier to what it was built for originally.

And then remove the eyesore "breakwater" and useless surplus linkspan that should never have built in the first place!

stanley37uk
07-17-2017, 20:23
One would presume a stock of spare parts is carried on board ( all ships)

tramscape
07-18-2017, 11:12
It is still unclear as to what is happening today. Waverley remains at Largs. WEL website was still advertising the cruise as leaving from Glasgow ...... until about 5 minutes ago when the website went off-line

tramscape
07-18-2017, 11:34
Seems she is starting from Largs

kylemore
07-18-2017, 12:15
I understand there has recently been a complete change of Engine Dept personnel - is that true?

Could this be a contributing factor in the recent technical problems?

tramscape
07-18-2017, 12:49
Yes, big turnover - and the loss of Kenny Henderson from the overall helm

Whether it is a contributory factor, I couldn't comment, but lost experience is lost experience

stanley37uk
07-18-2017, 13:48
Sailing today but seems to have been at Dunoon for ages ?

tramscape
07-18-2017, 14:03
Half an hour ..... big crowds ??? At least she seems to be fit and well for the moment

stanley37uk
07-18-2017, 14:14
" For the moment !! tramscape ............I know how you feel .
I can never imagine this being the most profitable sailing of the week but maybe there are loads of coaches ................

tramscape
07-18-2017, 14:31
There was a report last week of a remarkable number of coaches at Dunoon, so maybe this market is being exploited well this season. I guess the tour companies get big discounts, but that is the price you probably have to pay

Interestingly, the tour people get a nice short cruise - not enough time to get bored, but as I found out a couple of years ago, not enough time to even realise there was any food or drink for sale aboard !!!

tramscape
07-19-2017, 17:40
All seems to be going well today

With nothing in particular to comment on about today's cruise, I am just having a hell of a discussion on the facebook support forum where I took my heart in my hands and risked floating my proposal for converting Waverley to (primarily battery) hybrid operation, whilst retaining the visible machinery at the next "rebuild"

I got a lot of "likes" but nobody brave enough to go into print to support my proposal. Quite a few people, naturally, cannot see past steam

For me, I cannot see steam on Waverley, except perhaps the odd whistle toot - so I would not miss it.

I would rather see Waverley survive than perhaps face the armageddon of costly and unreliable, high-maintenance steam

Maybe they will come round - Galileo, of course, was ridiculed by most for most of his life .......

nthomas
07-19-2017, 19:31
Planned to convert Kingswear Castle to electric motors supplied by hydrogen fuel cells many times. These plans strangely always coincide with KC not running very well...

tramscape
07-19-2017, 21:00
You are not kidding me are you Nigel ?

Seriously, I would have thought that KC was of a scale where retaining steam propulsion was an entirely manageable proposition although I guess the recent cylinder issue brings matters into perspective

With KC to a large extent integrated into a wider organisation she is protected somewhat although I don't confess to know the details of how any risk is shared with the PSKC Trust

Waverley, it would seem is a different kettle of fish, on a grander scale, with risks equally magnified - and no wider organisation to share any burden, and a clear threat that unless things go totally smoothly, commercially, technically and meteorologically, the financial consequences are dire

Macfarlane64
07-19-2017, 22:50
I note several negative reviews on tripadvisor about Monday. All about the same thing - lack of information and poor customer service. Depressing, because it doesn't have to be like that.

kylemore
07-20-2017, 00:02
All seems to be going well today

With nothing in particular to comment on about today's cruise, I am just having a hell of a discussion on the facebook support forum where I took my heart in my hands and risked floating my proposal for converting Waverley to (primarily battery) hybrid operation, whilst retaining the visible machinery at the next "rebuild"

I got a lot of "likes" but nobody brave enough to go into print to support my proposal. Quite a few people, naturally, cannot see past steam

For me, I cannot see steam on Waverley, except perhaps the odd whistle toot - so I would not miss it.

I would rather see Waverley survive than perhaps face the armageddon of costly and unreliable, high-maintenance steam

Maybe they will come round - Galileo, of course, was ridiculed by most for most of his life .......

All seems a bit drastic - before going so far why don't we try and persuade SGV to run Waverley as a Scottish out station.

The PSPS could simply help with the odd contribution if there were any losses - but I bet there wouldn't be much of those!:)

tramscape
07-20-2017, 00:26
Nice idea, Kylemore ....... so simple it passed me by !

Some people on the discussion forum are saying that any change of power to Waverley would have MCA banning her outright - or at least removing any derogations she might still have

Not sure what the German authorities required of Goethe when this was done

tramscape
07-20-2017, 10:11
Waverley is off service again today ------ "operational reasons"

If these are not directly technical, then they are a result of past technical breakdowns, so essentially a consequence of the prime issue. Some have speculated that with all the recent troubles the crew are out of hours. Real cynics might suggest that with the weather so bad and possibly few turning up for a sail .........

tramscape
07-20-2017, 20:03
It would seem that the vocal people amongst the "Waverley Support Group" would rather see her scrapped than see her boilers replaced by something more reliable and more cost efficient

tramscape
07-20-2017, 20:52
Waverley has been at Largs all day and is still there.

One hopes she will be taking up her cruise from Glasgow in the morning as indicated on the website

tramscape
07-20-2017, 21:28
Judging by what I read I am rather frustrated when people closely associated with the ship and those "supporting" her feel that it is no big deal that a company which offers a product or service (in this case a published timetable) is unable to fulfill its own proposal

Anyone suggesting otherwise (and there are one or two) is shouted down

Working hard to try and rectify issues is seen as a success in itself. Not in the real world of business, unfortunately, after a very short while, I would contend

tramscape
07-21-2017, 00:06
Seems definitely to be an air pump which causes problems when the ship tries to dock

Of course not much can be done other than to work hard to ameliorate the problem - and try and get some sort of new one if that is possible

Nobody's fault - but the consequences are clear to see. I guess these are the sort of things we are going to have to live with - and if the public don't like it ..... well maybe those who say "tough" are taking a realistic approach . (I'm a bit shocked I said that)

I've always said that "in safe navigation conditions only" should be printed in bold at the top of any marketing materials. perhaps something should be added regarding "availability of vessel"

It remains beholden on the administrative office to provide information appropriately and handle the resulting issues expeditiously

sealegs
07-21-2017, 10:42
In 1903 SPLENDID SEA EXCURSIONS were being offered "(weather and circumstances permitting)" - and maybe that would be a suitable let-out for WEL now - although the excursions referred to were by
the "Splendid Saloon Paddle Steamer" ST ELVIES
ROUND THE ISLAND OF ANGLESEY

She started from Liverpool at 09-15 a.m. prompt and returned at about 8-0 p.m having sailed 170 miles non-stop. First class saloon fare was 7/6. Judging from comments on this group and elsewhere I cannot imagine there would be much enthusiasm for such a long sail today - but thet were presumably not constrained by a class III certificate!

stanley37uk
07-21-2017, 10:58
Today cancelled - third Friday in a row .

tramscape
07-21-2017, 11:04
Due to criticism of a friend on mine for his concern, expressed in another place, one person has been banned from that place for personal abuse

I am beginning to think that this is doing me no good and I really should chill out once and for all (my friend too) and seek out that Doris Day disc ..... Que Sera Sera ........ for a listen

tramscape
07-21-2017, 11:19
For those interested in Waverley as a business, WSN's annual report and accounts for the year to end October 2016 has been submitted and the Companies House website reports today that they will be available for view/download in 5 days time

That means they ought to be ready before I go off on holiday and give me some nice reading material

tramscape
07-21-2017, 11:32
Judging from comments on this group and elsewhere I cannot imagine there would be much enthusiasm for such a long sail today

I tell you Dick, there seem quite a few over in another place, for whom the maxim seems to be the longer the better !

kylemore
07-21-2017, 12:21
I tell you Dick, there seem quite a few over in another place, for whom the maxim seems to be the longer the better !

Well that keeps the annoying non enthusiasts and families (children running about the decks - bloody nuisances!) away.

Do remember Trams the whole point of the enterprise is to function as a hobby for a select retired/semi-retired crowd of "regulars" there on a daily basis:)

tramscape
07-21-2017, 15:11
I think WEL at least want to get away from that - but they can't

However, at the end of the day it was saved by enthusiasts, for enthusiasts and is now owned by enthusiasts - so that is the reality ....... and no getting away from it, we on here are enthusiasts too

In itself that is not a bad thing, but if it compromises progress it might be - but then preservation sort of means no progress anyway

Even I can't get my mind round what Waverley ought to be - so it has to tread a fine line between one path and the other, the whole organisation taking the criticisms that go with it in their stride - and hoping that the survival struggle can go on.

I guess that is one of the main problems or conundrums in this case - preservation depends on commerciality, but commerciality can't really justify preservation to any meaningful extent. It is easy to preserve say a vintage car in your garage on a non-commercial basis ......

Thinking about it too much does my head in - so maybe life as a "happy tripper" is the best one after all ...... but would I then be so keen to fork out next time an appeal comes around ?

tramscape
07-21-2017, 15:52
Saturday and Sunday now cancelled if anyone was planning on going

I hope those in charge are not just saying "Oh well, so be it" ....... but as I am now learning " whatever will be will be . The future's not ours to see (or do anything positive to change) .... Que Sera Sera"

Such a nice voice our Doris

tramscape
07-21-2017, 16:28
Imagine all the phone calls the WEL office will now be making. I hope they have some sort of plan with their telecoms provider !

Still no message on FB (to immediately alert all 7344 people who follow the page with one message) or twitter (where they have 3308 tweet-followers)

On second thoughts, broadcasting their travails wider than the most limited band of customers possible is possibly not the best idea !!! That must be their logic

kylemore
07-21-2017, 19:21
Whatever we may think of some of their policies at times we can all surely only have sympathy with the staff trying to deal with this - during Glasgow Fair as well!

No doubt there's a lot of hard work going on behind the scenes, lets hope they can get the show on the road ASAP.